When will Keystrokes w MioXM be fixed?

Hi
I use an MC8 and we have MioXM MIDI boxes to connect our gear on stage over RTP Ethernet.
I really could use the Keystroke facility of the MC8 firmware but unless I use the “NO KEYSTROKE” firmware, the MC* is not recognised by the XM.
Any idea when this will be fixed please?
Thanks
Mark

1 Like

I don’t think there’s any issue with the MIDI + Keyboard firmware as it is recognised by both Windows and MacOS without any issues as 2 separate interfaces (MIDI and Keyboard). I’m not sure how iConnectivity connects to these interfaces but that might be a question for them.

Hi James

Thats not what it says on the download section of your web site. There it clearly states that there is an issue with the firmware and you are looking into it.
Which is why I asked if you had any idea when it will be resolved. See attached screen shot of your web site.

Clearly there cant be any issue with the MioXM as it recognises the MC8 just fine if the version of firmware without the keystroke feature is used.

So again, do you have any idea when the issue will be fixed? I purchased the MC8 on the understanding that it provided keystroke capability. Only to later discover that it doesnt work with the MioXM. Given the MioXM is probably the most used MIDI/RTP interface by professional musicians, along with the PlayAudio12 for the audio interface capability, it would seem to be something that warrants fixing.

Regards
Mark

Screenshot 2021-08-03 at 18.15.01.png

That additional non-keyboard firmware is there because of a feedback from a single user that it doesn’t work with his MioXM from when we added the keyboard functionality in a firmware update.

There’s really nothing to fix - the firmware just exposes an additional keyboard interface when the device is connected to the computer, in additional to a MIDI interface. That’s all there is to it. MacOS and Windows detects both interfaces just fine. If the MioXM can’t detect a MIDI device with a keyboard interface exposed, the why doesn’t it work question might be for them.

Unless you know of other MIDI + Keyboard devices (not sure what else is there) that work fine with the MioXM. I checked their forum and it has only about 10 posts or less so there’s not much info there

Just some additional information I found in their knowledge base stating that their USB Host port will only work with MIDI devices

This port is not a normal USB port - it is designed solely to enable your interface to act as a stand-alone host for USB-MIDI keyboards and modules. However that means it can only pass MIDI information - you cannot use it as a normal USB port, or pass audio data via it. It is effectively the same as having extra MIDI In and Out ports but in the form of a USB port. This means you cannot use this port to connect a computer, phone, or tablet, or any other type of standard USB device.

As a consequence of this some controllers and synthesizers that have extra functionality which requires a direct connection to a computer may not work fully or work at all via the USB-MIDI Host Port.

https://iconnectivity.supportbee.io/53-iconnectivity-knowledgebase/534-midi/8517-what-does-the-host-port-on-my-iconnectivity-interface-do

As ‘the only user who complained about this’ and asked for a non-keyboard firmware, thanks @james to keept it, I am using it everyday with my 2 x MC8, so as this user, I can share one of the exchanges I had with IConnectivity support.

If the USB connection is sending BOTH ports on that connection then that is what will coming knocking on the host ports doors. We only let in MIDI data, so an audio port would stop the connection.
If a USB class compliant controller has multiple ports we can show all the ports in the USB host reservation.
I have a keyboard (Code 61) that has 4 MIDI USB ports on a single USB connection and all are seen by our host ports though I only use 1 or 2 depending on the connection on need.
The manufacturer sets the information on that connection.
Travis Short
Senior Tech Specialist
iConnectivity

It has been the never ending story where the user is kept in between two companies refusing to enter direct relationship to solve a special problem.
I must add that if until this day I have beern the only to report this problem and try to ask for a solution, I am certainly not the only one to use both Morningstar and IConnectivity devices, which are very useful and complementary products ( with my IConnectivity MIOXL/XM I have dedicated routing witch allows using the Morningstar online Chrome editor from a computer when the MC8 is not connected to it).
I am hoping that a solution will appear someday, certainly after a direct contact (we are not speaking of large companies as could be Oracle or Microsoft or HP or Google, etc. where a contact is something very touchy as US speaking to China) and we already know the names of the involved persons (they have public Facebook accounts easy to find in each company page) . So let’s pray … but I am not a believer and as I didn’t use Ableton, the No keyboard half solution is good for me. :frowning:

Hi
Good to hear from you. Thank you for posting this. As we 2 seem to be the ones ‘carrying the torch’ for this issue it is good to "meet up’
I have to say, I am somewhat disappointed at the ‘its not our problem’ attitude of the suppliers support effort. They both make very useful products but to be selling a product (Morningstar) where a ‘major new feature’ is released that simply does not work with another product (iConnectivity) which is a leading supplier of interfaces to many professional touring bands, not least Billie Eilish, Gaga etc. And then turns around and say ‘it’s not our problem’, contact them, is disappointing, verging on rude.
I expected better from Morningstar. I thought they were a smaller company that cared for their customers.
I DO use Ableton and there are many things I would like to do that would require the use of a remote keyboard interface like what is being advertised by Morningstar.
Ah well, we live and learn.

But there really is all there is to it. We created a new USB interface according to the USB specifications so a USB Host can identify the device as a MIDI controller and a Keyboard. MacOS identifies the devices just fine. And so does Windows. There’s really nothing more we can do about this. How the USB Host (iConnectivity) identifies the USB devices is completely out of our control.

They have already stated in their knowledge-base that MIDI devices with additional functionalities may not work with their products, which is why we still publish a MIDI-only interface for these users.

Anyway, the mioXM and mioXL only accepts MIDI signals and nothing else, so whether the Keyboard interface works or not is irrelevant with these products, because they do not accept keyboard commands.

Does he know that you were referring to an actual computer keyboard and not a MIDI keyboard? :grimacing: The Code 61 is a MIDI device and does not have any keyboard interface.

Please @james do contact him (or them, as recently it appeared on FB that they get a new product manager may be most open to some move).
I am totally confident that some email exchange, a phone call could be even faster, could help solve the issue which is certainly not such a problem.
As users, we appreciate the 2 products but have no knowledge of their respective technical constraints.

I hear what you are saying @james but to be honest I still feel a bit sore about spending $350+ on a MIDI interface that clearly advertises that it also acts as a kbd but only mentions that it will not work with a MioXM as a small “oh and by the way, message” in the firmware downloads section. I mean, really, just how deep does a customer have to investigate a product before buying it? Do you really think I should review download release notes before deciding if a product will do what I want? Without the Kbd feature of the MC8, what does it do that a $100 'standard" midi foot pedal wont do?
And what is more, in all reality, what use is foot pedal keyboard that is totally reliant on a USB connection with a max length of 5 meters? Are you saying I need to have my laptop less than 5 metres away from me on stage? It is never going to happen and so the feature is pointless. Who wants a foot keyboard when they are so close to their computer they can use the actual keyboard anyway.
Not happy.
And to be frank, the “its not our problem, contact them” attitude of Morningstar support sucks.

We’re always happy to help where we can but I dont understand how we can help in this case. It’s like saying it’s our fault that iConnectivity designed the USB Host port for THEIR products to only work with MIDI devices and not pass keyboard commands to the computer.

They’ve already stated in their product description that the USB Host port only accepts MIDi commands and connects with only MIDI devices. There’s no bug to fix - the mio is designed to work this way.

You can read this for more info: Is my MIDI device compatible with the iConnectivity USB-MIDI Host port?

I read that if you publish 2 ports where one is declared ‘only midi’ and the second not midi, the midi one will be ok for IConnectivity USB Host.
My thinking, and I already told you, is that it is just a matter of correctly declaring your ports versus what IConnectivity is expecting. Again some direct exchange should solve this pb.

There’s a reason why the USB-IF specifications exist, and that is what we adhere to. If we start conforming to another company’s standards, that will just make us non-compliant, and we’ll probably start having issues with other hosts.

Just to clarify your doubts over our USB configuration, I just set this rig up:
MC6 USB >> MIDI USB DIN Converter (which is a USB Host) >> MC8 MIDI IN
The MIDI host reads USB MIDI messages from the MC6 just fine and passes it along to the MC8.

I’m not sure how I can convince you otherwise that any USB Host will have access to the USB configuration descriptor (there is only one standard) and these USB Hosts can be programmed to do what they want with the connected USB device interfaces. In this case, it just seems like the mioXM is rejecting the entire device when it detects that there is a Keyboard interface present.

And trust me, I would love to stop having to publish 2 separate firmwares for each of our products just for this if there was anything we could do.

I know the effort you are making and for sure the communication on the IConnectivity side has always been strange but this company is changing, as I said before, a new name appeared on their FB page, may be the clever part will engage the move and try a first contact via PM on FB with either ‘@Travis D Short’ (support but not dev) or ‘@Al Joelson’ (product manager) and you.

I just posted this on FB IConnectivity User Community : iConnectivity User Community : I would appreciate a direct contact between IConnectivity and Morningstar to try to solve the actual IConnectivity issue with MC8 midi controller : my MIOXL and MIOXM are not able to manage an extension in Morningstar USB port which allows to send keyboard commands over USB, the idea behind this is to be able to control Ableton Live

Just saw your FB post, thanks.

But if they wanted the port to accept Keyboard commands, they would have implemented it already. It’s not related to the MC3/6/8, so there’s really no input from us. If you plug it a computer keyboard directly to the mioXM USB Host port, it won’t work, and that’s because they designed the USB Host port as a USB MIDI port only, as stated in their product description.

If you plug in a Microsoft keyboard to the mioXM and it doesn’t work, will you reach out to Microsoft to ask iConnectivity to add this feature, and then blame Microsoft because their (iConnectivity) products do not accept keyboard commands?

If they require any information, of course we’d be glad to help. But what you’re suggesting is for us to tell them that they should implement the keyboard functionality for their users. Which I really don’t understand. What it seems like you should do instead is raise a request along with other mioXM users if you want them to implement keyboard functionality.

I know since the beginning.
But consider the Elektron Model:Cycles and Samples.
If in their settings I choose for their USB Port ‘MIDI+AUDIO’ then IConnectivity does not see them.
And if I change in the Elektron settings USB Port ‘MIDI’ only, it works with IConnectivity… to the price I can’t do audio via USB.
Could you consider a similar option for MC8 and have only one firmware, with USB options MIDI ONLY and MIDI+KEYCOMMANDS ?
And for sure IConnectivity should be able to manage KEY COMMANDS for those using Ableton Live, actually I am not…

My main ‘beef’ @james is that you are promoting your box as providing a keyboard interface which is a very appealing and useful option and in fact is why I chose your device over other, less expensive options. But you do not warn prospective buyers that it does not work with one of the most used (by professionals) midi interfaces on the planet. Other than a small footnote in the release notes of the firmware download page. Very misleading and not helpful. And who is to blame is irrelevant. You are selling your box and promoting that feature. The limitations, from wherever they originate, should be made clear.
It would be like Ford saying that their cars have Internet connection but not telling you that it doesn’t work with Verizon.
On a more positive note, maybe you can help me by confirming if the MC8 kbd interface will work over usb with a Cat5 based extender. They claim the extender works with hard drives, webcams, printers etc. So how about an MC8. As I said before. For pro live use, being tethered to a usb length cable makes the kbd option in an MC device useless. Nobody has their laptop 10 feet away on stage.
Thanks
Mark

Have you tried Bome box ?

We have not figured out how to do this yet but will explore in the future

Thanks for this description. So it is evident that the mioXM/L products cannot work with any USB devices with multiple interfaces except a MIDI-only one - nothing to do with our USB configuration

Sorry Mark, but I really do not understand this point. There are probably tens, or hundreds, or thousands of products out there, each with different capabilities and functionalities. The limitations are not on our end. The MC3/6/8 works as intended as a MIDI controller and Keyboard. Obviously, if you try to plug it into a MIDI-only USB Host interface (and iConnectivity already made this very clear in their product description that it only accepts USB-MIDI signals), it will not work. Why is the burden on us to warn you that it will not work?

Should Microsoft and every other keyboard manufacturer also publicise this information about their computer keyboards that they will not work with the mioXM as well, because the mioXM is the most used MIDI interface on the planet?

I’m having a very hard time understanding this logic, but please understand I’m not trying to come across as rude.

No, it will probably not work. And it depends on what you connect the extender to?

An analogy like this would be more representative:
Ford says that their car has internet connection via 5G. Verizon plans only provides only 4G connection, but yet you sign up with them. You blame Ford for not telling you that it can’t work with Verizon.