Hi, I am new to MIDI but learning fast. My pedalboard contains 11 pedals, 5 Source Audio connected to their Neuro Hub and 5 boost/drive pedals and a Wah that are mono pedals. What would be my best and most inexpensive solution to be able to switch all my pedals? I also have an Airstep SMC and a Lite. I can obviously use those to control a switcher. It’s not as good as using a footswitch with screens but the Airsteps are like new and would like to use them, if possible. I would also like to keep the Neuro Hub to control the 5 SA pedals. I would love to get a MC6 and the ML10X but I have already spent a bunch on the pedals and would think I can get away with the switcher for now. I think your products are amazing and would be eager to try one in my rig.
My board consists of:
Boss FV500 Volume pedal>CAE MC404 Wah>TS-808-MXR Super Badass>Wampler Velvet Fuzz> TrueTone VS-XO>Keeley Compressor Pro> mono out to a Hughes & Kettner TubeMeister 36> Send out to Source Audio Gemini> Mercury> Nemesis ADT> True Spring> EQ2 (Stereo) > Return on TubeMeister and Delta King 12.
Thanks in advance for any help.
I don’t know the Airstep specs really well, but I’m assuming you’re using the lite as an extension of the SMC, and the SMC has MIDI outs that would go to the Neuro Hub and one of our switchers.
Since Source Audio pedals can be engaged/bypassed with MIDI, they don’t need a switcher unless you’re doing some fancy routing. That just leaves the drive section and the wah. We offer two 5-loop switchers and one 10-loop switcher. Each has a unique use case:
ML5 - 5 mono loop, true-bypass looper. MIDI-controlled switching (direct per-loop switching or via presets)
ML5R - 5 mono loop, buffered looper. Reorderable signal chain. MIDI-controlled switching (direct or presets) and loop reordering.
ML10X - 5 stereo loops (each configurable as 2 mono loops, for up to 10 mono loops). Totally configurable signal chain (reordering as well as split and merge). MIDI-controlled switching (direct or via presets). Signal chain / loop reordering only via editor (simple chain editing is also possible on-board).
Feel free to share your signal chain in greater detail, as that might help to determine whether you can get away with 5 loops (ML5 or ML5R) or absolutely need 10 (ML10X).
Hi Jason,
Thanks for the quick reply. I didn’t think I needed the switcher for the Source Audio pedals since it’s connected to the Neuro Hub. I would like to control the drive pedals though so maybe a ML5R would be enough. My signal chain is: CAE MC404 Wah>TS-808>MXR Super Badass>Wampler Velvet Fuzz> TrueTone VS-XO>Keeley Compressor Pro out to the front of my first amp. Then I’m taking the Send out to the first Source Audio and through to the rest of the pedals in stereo. Then out to the returns on both my amps. I guess I can go into the ML5R from the out of the Wah and use loop A-E to connect the Tube Screamer, Badass, Velvet Fuzz, VS-XO and the KC Pro.
The SMC could be used to change presets on the switcher and the Lite can be used to switch scenes on the Neuro Hub. Since I just play at home and don’t gig, I think this would be good enough for me.
If I were to get a controller like the MC6 down the road, would I be able to send messages to both the Neuro Hub and the ML5R at the same time? For example go out of the MIDI on the MC6 to the ML5R and thru to the Neuro Hub. That would be cool if the Airsteps don’t work right.
Thanks.
Just to add my 2c re the AirStep SMC and Lite vs Morningstar controllers: I had (and still have) the AirSteps but ditched them a few years ago because a) the Morningstar controllers are SOOOOO much better, and b) I was so frustrated and angry when it became apparent that promised updates to both the AirStep hardware and app were never going to happen after years of failed promises. And these have still never eventuated; all that happens is that new half-baked products keep being rolled out.
On the other hand, Morningstar is constantly updating firmware and the editor, in addition to listening to the community and implementing feature requests whenever these are possible.
Finally, there’s the customer support which is second to none in this industry 
Maddcow,
Thanks for the input. I appreciate any information since I am pretty green at MIDI. Although I know that the incredibly intelligent person that demonstrates the MS boxes is probably one of the geniuses making these very cool and innovative products or at least very familiar with them, I have spent a lot of money on new pedals and the Airsteps to plunk down another $400-500, especially since I don’t use my rig to gig. I just love technology and challenging myself with it.
That said, I don’t I need much to make my rig work for me the way I want it to. I just want it to be a little more simplified. So if I can control my drives with the ML5 or ML5R and talk to the Hub to change scenes using the footswitches I already have, I think I’ll be happy.
I understand that the Airsteps are limited and I don’t understand their marketing strategy either.If you buy an SMC, it will do everything all their other “specialized” controllers do. I have a THR10IIWL, a Spark 40, a Tonex and Waza Airs and my SMC can control them all. I just have to change the firmware before I connect to one particular piece of gear. So why even make the limited, less expensive ones. There not much better than those manufacturers’ own accessories. And for basic PC and CC messages, it’s a decent controller.
That’s not to say if I really like the ML5 or ML5R, I wouldnt get a MC6 or even a MC6 Pro. And I am leaning that way. I’m still not sure though if I can program my MIDI pedals through the Neuro Hub using the MC6. I know the Nemesis ADT and the EQ2 are MIDI-ready and I can assign parameters to the other 3 that I have (Gemini, Mercury & True Spring). With the little that I know about all this stuff, I’m thinking if I add one of the ML5 switchers and the MC6, I can connect the MC6 to the ML5 then out to the Neuro Hub and that should allow me with the editor to setup program changes to the drive pedals and/or the Neuro Hub to change scenes on the Source Audio pedals and also send CC messages to the individual SA pedals because they have their own MIDI Channel coming off the Hub. Does that make any sense?
Once I figure out if and how it works, I may just pull the trigger on both. The MS editor is amazing!
Both the Airsteps and our controllers offer the ability to send multiple messages at once (8 for the Airstep, 32 for our Pro models). Our devices are easier to navigate for a whole host of reasons (screens, banks and pages, etc.), but if all you’re trying to do is press a switch to engage/bypass a bunch of pedals at once, then totally try it out with the Airsteps first and when/if you start feeling limited by them, you’ll have a greater sense of what the Morningstar controllers can offer you.
I do have a Neuro Hub (two actually), so I know pretty well how that ecosystem works. There are two ways to control Source Audio pedals attached to the hub:
- The hub enables direct MIDI connection to the pedals, so I ignore the hub functionality altogether and basically use the hub as a MIDI Box. Source Audio pedals don’t have fixed MIDI mapping, so you do have to go into the editor and map the functions you want to MIDI CCs, but once you do, you can just talk directly to the pedals.
- The hub also features Scenes activated by Program Change (PC), which set the presets and engage/bypass state for every attached pedal. The nice thing here in a simple setup is that you send one PC message to the Neuro Hub, and then it tells all attached pedals what to do. Doing method 1 above, setting engage/bypass and changing presets for five pedals is at least 5 MIDI messages.
If you were to use the ML5R, that also functions in two ways: (1) call presets via PC, where each preset represents a pedal order + engage/bypass state; (2) directly set the pedal order and bypass states via CC.
You’ll need to decide what exactly what your footswitches are doing, whether they are static (they always do one thing) or if they change functions based on bank (airsteps have 5 banks, I believe), and what those functions are, but that’s always a very personal choice and depends on playing style, how much footwork you’re okay with, and your memory (since the airsteps have no display).
Jason,
I decided to replace the rest of my pedals with Source Audio ones. So I got a second Hub too. I should be able to, according to SA, create scenes with any or all pedals by using the same MIDI channel for both Hubs and then saving them on both hubs. Then, by using Channels 2-16 for the pedals themselves. I should have access to the pedals individually in the Neuro editor. I can also edit presets and save them on my mobile devices/pedals by using TRS connections via Input 2 on the pedals themselves. As you may know, the Input 2 I/Os carry data signals on the ring and audio on the tip for stereo or split audio applications. I even use a 1/4” TRS to a 1/8” TRS plugged into a Bluetooth audio adapter to use my mobile device wirelessly. I think that should be all I need on the editing and control side. I’m hoping the Airsteps won’t drive me crazy but if they do, I will definitely be getting an MC6, at least.
It’s funny because I edited TV shows for 28 before retiring and now I’m learning how to edit gear and MIDI via software editors! I guess once an editor, always an editor!
Thanks for your help. I am really impressed with your products and if I decide to get one of your controllers, I can pay for some of it with the sale of the 2 Airsteps.
I think Xsonic makes a good product. But their software has a bit of a learning curve. Not like your editor which helps the programmer a lot more. Having almost every MIDI pedals’ info at your fingertips for input and programming and that cut and paste feature is priceless. I’m slowly talking myself into one of your products! Maybe it will be a good news year!