Hello! I would love for there to be more toggle reset groups on the Morningstar MC6 pro. I mean, a LOT more. Preferably, hundreds. I’m trying to have a preset on my multiFX for each song, and then 2-3 scenes for each preset. I want the unit to mark when they are engaged, and I need them to only be engaged one at a time. So, I need a LOT more toggle reset groups.
Also, I want something like toggle groups, but for CC messages. For example, some presets I use send a MIDI message to my amp to adjust amp settings. But I’ve also got a page that lets me adjust the settings individually. I need the individual amp settings to stay synced with the status while using the song presets.
Is it not feasible to reuse Toggle Reset Groups? For any toggle reset groups that are local to a bank (meaning, it’s not trying to sync with something on another bank), just reuse the same one.
That’s the thing. I am trying to sync things across multiple banks. Although, most of the things I’d like to sync across multiple banks are the things that would benefit from having a message-level toggle feature.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but toggle and toggle reset groups are global, right? So, if I’d like to have a toggle reset group for each of the songs I’m doing (say, I have a preset for verse, chorus, and bridge, for each song. I want 1. the screen to indicate which one is active and 2. have it so that only 1 can be active at a time) then I’d need a lot more than 8 toggle reset groups.
And as I typed this I realized that I need more toggle reset groups, but I need message level toggle groups, not toggle resets. Edited the post to reflect that.
But why do those need to be global? It’s not like your songs are all playing at the same time. If you go to a bank, reset all of its switches, and start playing, it’s not like the settings in any other song would affect it.
Well, now I’m getting conflicting info. I read somewhere that toggle resets are global, but I just read somewhere else that they’re not. I’ve been operating on the assumption that they are. If not, well then I’m a dumbass and that problem is solved. Although, since they’re shared across pages, more would be nice. 12-16 would probably cover anything anyone could ever need.
In that case, my only request is message-level toggle groups, and a lot of them.
They ARE global, but it doesn’t really matter if you’re only focusing on one bank at a time. Let me give you an example:
Let’s say Banks 1, 2, and 3 each have presets A, B, and C in the same toggle reset group. Technically when one of them is toggled on, all of the other 8 are toggled off. But if you only care what is happening in one bank at any given moment, does that really matter? The switches in the other banks will just be off when you get there, but when you start interacting, it will just be the current A,B,C that you are switching between.
As for your message-level toggle groups question, I still don’t have any idea what you’re talking about, honestly.
I hadn’t thought about it like that! I’m going to try and set that up today. I don’t see any reason why it shouldn’t work. Thanks! It’s been a lot to learn since I got this pedal lol. There are so many options!
You may not understand the thing about message toggle reset groups because it doesn’t currently exist, it’s a feature request. I have some things that, on some pages, are controlled with a toggle that’s only sending a single CC, and that single CC on another page is a part of many CCs being sent at once. I may not want those other CCs to be part of that toggle group, only the single CC. So I’d like to be able to select that single message (hence the term message-level, rather than preset level, toggle group).
Of course, there’s also the possibility that this is coming from another fundamental lack of understanding on my part.
Ok! Sorry for the late reply, nursing school has been taking up most of my time. For starters, I probably should have worked the original most as “message-level toggle groups,” rather than “CC level toggle reset groups.” I’m still getting used to all of this new nomenclature. Sorry for the long post, but it sounds like you want me to be hyper-specific, so here goes:
To start off, I’m using this for a cover band. We currently have about 50 songs that we rotate through. We also do at least one “jam” per set, but sometimes more. It’s a different vibe or style each time. I have ways to control each of my midi devices separately, so that I can easily be flexible for our jam spaces, and then I have an artist → song folders, with the presets for each song/each part of the song. Visually, my workflow looks like this:
My “home page (bank 1)” has 4 main options:
Anagram - selecting this takes me to bank 2, which has a couple of pages of anagram presets. This is to be used for the open jam. The anagram has enough banks that I’ve created separate presets for the songs vs the jams, so I don’t have to worry about them being in the same toggle reset group with anything else.
Envelope filter - selecting this takes me to bank 4, which has 7 presets for my envelope filter. The envelope filter only has 6 presets on the device (preset 7 is bypass), so it would be nice for these presets to sync with the associated PC commands in my song presets, but the song presets are all part of their own toggle reset group. The solution that I’ve proposed in this thread is to be able to set a toggle group-like function for the specific message in the song preset that will link the message (PC in this case) being sent to engage a preset on the envelope filter in the song preset with the preset I have in the previously mentioned envelope filter folder for the same command. Ex: I turn on the “them changes” preset. This triggers the anagram to go to the “them changes” preset and the envelope filter to go to preset 3. But now, if we do a jam next song and I go to the envelope filter folder, it will show all of the envelope filter presets as being disengaged.
Genz Benz - selecting this takes me to bank 3, which has the options for my amp settings. I’m running an RJM mini amp gizmo to the footswitch port of my amp to control 5 settings: Preamp mix, Tube/FET preamp select, L.F. boost, mid scoop, and H.F. attack. The RJM has 12 channels, and each channel has 2 CC values: one for on, one for off. I’m using 5 channels, so that is a range of 5 CCs that I’m using. On the Genz Benz page, I have each of these channels set as a toggle switch, with one CC value for on in pos 1 and the other for off in pos 2. Only the preamp mix and tube/fet preamp need to be in a toggle reset group together. The problem here is similar to the envelope filter. Take the “them changes” situation. Supposed that another thing that happened when I engaged the “them changes” preset was that I sent a CC message to turn on the LF boost. I can’t set that to be in a toggle group with the LF boost preset in the Genz Benz folder, because the “them changes” preset is already a part of a toggle reset group with all of the other song presets. Also, it just wouldn’t make sense to set that to a toggle group with the entire song preset, because the song preset is controlling devices like the anagram that don’t need to be part of the toggle group. So it would be nice to be able to set that single message (CC in this case) to be in a toggle group-like thing with the LF boost preset in the Genz Benz folder. If I went to the Genz Benz folder for a jam after this song, the way the options are currently, the RJM/amp toggles wouldn’t be synced with the actual state of the RJM/amp.
Artists - selecting this takes me to another bank that has artists listed in alphabetical order through its 4 pages. If I click on the name of an artist, it does a bank jump, and I have a bank for each artist. Each artist bank has a song per page, and each page has presets for each part of the song (this is where page titles would be really nice). Some songs only need one preset, some need 2 or more. Because I need it to show only a single song as being engaged at a time, the song presets are set in their own toggle reset group (ex: around the world intro+verse, around the world chorus, tighten up intro+verse, tighten up verse, the changes, etc.). The song presets are engaging or disengaging any combination of the three devices that I have currently hooked up, eventually more once I add a keyboard synthesizer. Because of the current state of the software, I can’t set any of the individual messages to sync with the presets I have that control those same messages individually.
Ok, I know this was a lot to read, but this is my situation. I’ve figured out some workarounds, but that’s how I’d like it to work, and I don’t think it’s that crazy a thing to want (although I’m not a programmer, so maybe it is). My workarounds are basically: on “enter bank” for the artists and home folders, have a disengage message going to the envelope filter, and 5 “off” messages going to the RJM for each of its parameters. I currently have it set up so that I have to go through those folders to change songs or get into my “jam” workflow, so they act as kind of a “reset” to get everything synced back up. It’d be nice not to always have to go back to these folders, though.
A few other things worth mentioning:
It’d be cool to get more banks when selecting to use fewer than 4 pages in a bank. Like, if I’ve got 4 banks set to use 3 pages, that would equate to 1 extra bank of 4 pages. This probably wouldn’t need to be an option, though if there were more page settings, similar to all of the settings we have for banks.
It’s already mentioned, but being able to change the words on the screen for individual pages would be cool. I’m currently using a preset slot just to display the individual song names for the song pages.
As GuitarWolf mentioned, the current way to do what you want is to use Engage Preset. Where button latency doesn’t matter, I like to add “remote control” actions based on the Long Double Tap and Long Double Tap release actions (See Note below), since they’re so rarely used.
For example, let’s go with your Envelope Filter. It has 7 presets, including the bypass, and they’re all on their own toggle reset group. So for each one, I could simply add these actions:
Long Double Tap → CC or PC message to set it
Long Double Tap → a mesage to turn this toggle on
Wherever you want to call this preset, regardless of bank, send an Engage Preset → Long Double Tap to this Bank+Preset, and it will automatically update it for your live use.
Note: when you add actions like long press, double tap, or long double tap to a switch, the controller adds some delay to that switch to determine what kind of action you’re doing.
Hey Jason, thanks! These are some good solutions as well. Ultimately, though, part of the reason that I bought the MC6 pro in the first place was to reduce how much I need to use my foot and the amount of thinking that I have to do about my pedals during performance. I think these are some good workarounds, but I do think that my idea about having a toggle group-like option that can link individual messages with other presets would add a nice bit of granularity to what the MC6 pro already offers.