Former RJM user wondering if ml10x will work in a similar way

I apologize if this has been brought up before, but I’ve looked for a few threads similar to mine, but haven’t seen any exactly answering it.

I’ve have had midi systems before (RJM, Switchblade, etc) and am looking at putting together another system using morningstar, if possible. I am looking to integrate midi (strymon timeline, mobius and big sky as well as their deco, of which I might get the new midi version if this works out), the chase bliss generation loss mkii as well as non-midi pedals (EHX superego +, pitchfork and a few drive pedals, 12 pedals in total) which I could organize into banks as songs, using midi to switch banks on the strymons and turn on and off pedals . I am assuming to do this, I would need one of your MC pedals (I was thinking the MC8) as well as the ML10X. Does this seem correct to you? Would I be able to organize loops switching pedals in and out of the loop, organized into presets? I am thinking similarly to how the RJM PBC works. Would the MC8 + ML10x do this?

Yes this sounds correct to me!

How many pedals would you be able to theoretically control? Would you be able to move them in and out of the path?

The MC8 can send up to 16 midi messages per preset so technically up to 16 devices with one press assuming you are sending only one midi message to each of them. I am not as familiar with the ML10x since it’s new and I do not own it, but based on the midi implementation chart you can send Midi CC messages to add or remove pedals to the path at will.

I guess I am thinking of the way the rjm mastermind pbc works where you plug the audio loops into it as well as the midi. How many pedals can you turn on and off as far as audio?

The ML10X has 10 loops plus A/B, Dual mono or stereo outputs.

The MC’s can send up to 16 messages at any one time, although it can trigger other settings at the same time so it’s not ‘just’ 16 messages.

With that in mind, in simple mode, the ML10X’s loops can be switched on/off individually with a single message. This means 1 of the 16 messages. In advanced mode it’s a little different as any settings become ‘fixed’ per patch as the signal path needs to remain defined.

So the mc8 doesn’t support any effects loops?

The MC series do not support any bypass loops on it’s own. it requires the ML5 or ML10X which house the bypass loops.

So i wouldn’t have been able to accommodate 12 pedals like I was originally asking you about…

I’m not sure I completely follow the question:

The RJM PBC 6X has 6 loops: 3 mono, 3 stereo giving a total of 9 loops. The ML10X has 5 stereo loops giving a total of 10 mono loops, which is one additional.

The RJM PBC 10 has 10 loops: 6 mono and 4 Stereo giving a total of 14 loops. The ML10X would have 4 less.

If you had the PBC 10 then the ML10X might not have the number of loops you require.

Alternatively, the three big Strymon pedals and chase bliss are midi capable which means they wouldn’t require loops, only midi messages. If the total number of pedals you have is 12 and the deco was in front of the amp then you might only need 8 loops.

If however you have 12 non-midi pedals then the number of loops will be 2 fewer than you want.

If would be useful to know the prospective layout and exact pedals as some can be switched using control functionality.

I apologize- I was at a show while reading that via my email app and thought I was replying to someone else. :face_with_open_eyes_and_hand_over_mouth: You answered my question. I’d been trying to get this out of morningstar, but there seemed to be some sort of disconnect. Not to bother you again, but do you know if you can program a midi message to strymon or chase bliss pedals for bypass?

No need to apologise and happy to help. Hope the show was good.

All big strymon pedals share a bypass method which can be sent uniquely to each unit based on their midi channel number.

CC# 102 CC value 0 = bypass
CC# 102 CC value 127 = active

OK, that makes more sense. Why was morningstar telling me I needed to put my midi units in the ml10x?

I’m not sure why they might say that, unless the reference was for the non-midi pedals. Midi pedals don’t have a dependency unless you want them out of the chain.

Yeah, I’m not sure. I am looking at possibly using it with a wet/dry/wet setup. Would that sacrifice some sends?

The out of the ML10X can be stereo, A/B or dual mono, which will give wet/dry.

right, but wet/dry/wet would sacrifice a send, right?

Just trying to think through the routing to achieve W/D/W and if it’s technically possible without compromising the final output stage. I’ve never used that setup which makes my knowledge theoretical rather than practical on the subject.

If you want to make use of the reordering capabilities then you’ll need to put it in the ML10X. If it is outside of the ML10x then the order of their pedals can either be only before or after the pedals connected in the ML10X

This is how they told me, which I don’t quite understand (how does the overdrive have three outputs?):

“it is possible to do a WDW routing on the ML10X. Here’s a generic WDW setup, where the dry signal is routed to the Output, while the 2 Send ports are utilized to send the Wet signal to the 2 other amplifiers”: