Hey there, I’m fairly new to the MIDI world. I’ve currently got a DMC.micro that I’m using to control a handful of Source Audio pedals that are no longer responding to the DMC now that I’ve involved a NeuroHub. I’m considering getting a Morningstar product, but I can’t find a ton of info on how it works compared to what I’m used to with the DMC.
One of the things I liked about the DMC was that it had a preset mode where I could create a bunch of different presets all in a row and just scroll through them, and it also had a device mode where I could control each pedal individually. It also had a utility mode that allowed me to do things like utilize the tap and then hold feature that the option button on the Source Audio Ventris has. It could also do tap tempo things that would set a bpm for all of the connected devices. Is there any chance the MC3 or the MC4 Pro does all of these as well?
Sorry if these are obvious answers to y’all, I’m still trying to wrap my head around how MIDI controllers work.
The Morningstar controllers can do all of these things, but you’ll need to program them. Our controllers use a banks + pages structure, where each page represents the current arrangement of switches. The MC3 has 30 banks and 2 pages each, while the MC4 Pro has 128 banks and 4 pages each.
You can program actions that are triggered by the switches themselves (press, release, long press, double tap, etc.) and actions that are triggered by entering/exiting banks and pages. I have a bunch of Source Audio pedals too, so one thing I like to do is have some banks act like “scenes”, where entering them automatically sets up all the pedals a certain way, and then the switches themselves do various individualized controls (tap, reverb hold, swap presets for a pedal, engage/bypass, etc.)
Incidentally, your DMC.micro should still work as long as you assign individual MIDI channels to all the devices. The Neuro Hub needs its own channel, but it lets all the pedals retain their individual channels as well, and you can then communicate with them through that. I know because I literally only use my Neuro Hub as a 5-way MIDI splitter for Source Audio.
Of course, our controllers give you way more options, but ALSO, I want to make sure you’re understanding the way MIDI is working between your devices so you don’t end up buying solutions that you don’t need.
Interesting. I may be waiting for the MC4 Pro to come out in a few weeks and pick one up, in that case. How were you able to get the NH working, though? It doesn’t seem to be communicating at all with my DMC. I have the individual pedals MIDI numbers set to match the MIDI numbers that I have them set to in the DMC, but it’s still not interacting correctly. I also have the NeuroHub set to MIDI channel 15 as suggested by Disaster Area, but I’m wondering if I need to set the NeuroHub to basically channel 2 and program all my scenes on the NH via the Neuro app, and then just recall those scenes via a single program change command going to the NH. I’m just trying to get things kind of working for a show next week, but the reading I’ve done on the Morningstar products made me wish I would have gone down that path first off.
Could you also go into a little more detail about the banks + pages structure? In the case of the MC4 Pro, I assume the “pages” are like a single button of the 4 on the front, and a “bank” is that entire screen of the 4 options? Do any of your videos on the YT channel go into the banks + pages setup?
I really don’t like the Neuro Hub Scenes, but in this case it might make sense because (1) it simplifies everything to just a single PC message and (2) you’d be able to control more than 3 pedals.
It’s been a while since I’ve actually played with a dmc.micro, but if I were to set it up, I would just pretend the Hub wasn’t there, and that I had three pedals, one each assigned to DevA, DevB, and DevC, programmed to whatever their channels were. What Source Audio pedals are you using?
As for the MC4’s layout: a “page” is one entire 4-switch “layout,” and a bank is a collection of 4 of those pages. Each switch is a “preset” capable of 32 individual actions that you program, and those actions can be triggered in a variety of different ways (press, long press, release, etc.). So for example, you might load up the MC4 to a home “page” on bank 1. Everything on bank 1 might be basic utilities or jumps to other banks. What I like to do is to have a couple of banks for pedal-specific controls, and then starting with bank 20 or so, I have each bank represent a song. Each switch on that song bank can then be anything … on one song, it might load the presets for my “chorus”, “solo”, “verse,” or on another, it might let me swap between gain or reverb levels, etc.
Hey Jason, just following up. Thank you for the help so far. I finally figured out how to work with the Neurohub. I didn’t realize I couldn’t make scenes from existing presets, but that I had to turn on each attached pedal, set it to the preset I wanted, and THEN click “save” in the Neuro app to make the “scene” on the NH. After I got the scenes on the NeuroHub saved to each preset channel, I set the NH as MIDI #1 and I just selected presets of the NH which recalled all the “scenes” and I was able to combine that with separate presets from my chorus pedal that was set to MIDI #2 to get my overall tone I wanted. It works for now, but it isn’t what I’m really looking for as my long term solution.
After all the reading I’ve done, though, I believe I still want to go with the MC4 Pro. The Disaster Area controller is quite good and offers a lot of compatibility with such a small footprint, but it’s kind of comparatively limited on functionality and also it can only control 4 pedals at once. I think your (I assume you’re the company owner or at least an employee of MS?) MIDI solution offers the flexibility I’m really looking for. I see y’all are based outside of the US. Given importing items is kind of difficult right now due to our current administration, do y’all have any US sellers that I could order from or do y’all just sell direct for the time being? No issues with ordering from a company outside the US, I’ve just had one of my pedals stuck at customs for a few extra weeks in the recent past and I’d like to avoid that again if possible. Also, any idea on when the MC4 Pro is going to be available for purchase? I see it’s either sold out or just not released right now.
I use a micro clock to run a similar workflow on my board. The micro clock is the Midi clock source and it pipes into the MC8. I set up song BPMs via the preset system on the micro clock and use it to “advance” to the next song. A challenge with this is that the micro clock’s preset system is a bit limited, the MC8 requires multiple CC messages to do bank and preset jumps, but it works great for me. It’s annoying to have to load song BPMs and names into the micro clock and have two devices to fiddle with, but I see the micro clock as the time keeper and the MC8 as the midi brain.
Get the MC4. The morning star ecosystem is really good.
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Interesting you brought up the MIDI clock device from DA. What does that actually do? Both the DMC.micro and the MC4 will do tap tempo as well as specific BPM adjustment, correct? I’m having trouble understanding how the MIDI clock device isn’t redundant given those two MIDI controllers have those possibilities. Could you help me understand what I might be missing?
Yep, I’m a product specialist (which basically means I’m on the support staff). We haven’t had too much trouble getting product to the U.S., but there are a handful of U.S. retailers that sell Morningstar products directly, including Vintage King and Perfect Circuit.
As for MC4 Pro availability, I’m not on the fulfillment side so I’m not sure, but our website currently lists end of March. It’s a good idea to sign up for the email on our product page as well, just in case some comes in early: MC4 PRO
I wasn’t a huge fan of the “midi clock slot” implementation on the MC8Pro. It’s not bad, it just didnt’ solve what I wanted it to solve. Also, I like having tap tempo as a dedicated switch so I don’t take up a slot on the controller.
I apologize, I actually misread your DMC micro as the micro clock! My statements are a bit orthogonal.
