Am I not understanding toggles correctly?

I’m trying to achieve something I’m pretty sure you can do with toggles, but it’s not working. Here’s an explanation:

I have a preset (Preset V) on every bank that turns on the ML10X loop for the Meris LVX and uses a CC command to turn the LVX’s tuner functionality on. It also changes the background colors as well. I have an external switch with a specific button set to engage this Preset V. The way the LVX works is that the same CC message is used to turn the tuner on and off (annoyingly). So Position 1 sends the CC message to turn on the tuner functionality and position 2 sends the same CC message, which then turns off the tuner. Position 1 also changes the background color and Position 2 sets it back to normal.

I’m trying to set it up so that when I press any other preset in the bank, the LVX tuner turns off (if it’s already on) and the color goes back to normal. I would think that this was just a matter of having all other presets toggle off Preset V (the tuner preset). But when I set that up (with a Set Toggle command), it doesn’t work. Should this work and something else is going on, or am I not understanding toggles correctly?

Hi,
a ‘set toggle’ command only has an effect on the toggle position of the preset. It won’t trigger any messages.
What you are looking for is the ‘engage preset’ message type. This command will trigger the messages as if you were pressing the foot switch.

Thanks for the advice. But how would that initiate position 2, specifically? Wouldn’t engage preset turn on position 1?

Actually I’m not sure. ‘Engage Preset’ might trigger the pos2 messages if the preset is in pos2.
You could alternatively just add the CC to disengage the tuner to your other presets and keep the ‘set toggle’ message. This would have the same outcome

I actually can’t use the CC message in the individual presets because the LVX message to turn on the tuner is the same to turn it off (it’s just a toggle). So if I did that, the tuner would turn on whenever it’s off and I select a new preset. That’s why I need something that will just toggle the tuner preset off when it’s on, but will do nothing otherwise.

Tricky to do.
What if you programmed a ‘set toggle’ ‘shift +’ (all other presets) to your tuner preset. And then programm the CC in ‘pos shift’ to the other presets. That way the message will only trigger if the tuner is on. You’d have to add an ‘unshift’ to your tuner preset in case you turn it off using the tuner preset . Additionally you’d have to add an ‘unshift’ (all others) in position shift to avoid toggeling the tuner when changing presets.

I really appreciate all your help with this! I’m intrigued, but I think you’ve lost me. I haven’t used shift functionality much. I think I have a basic understanding of how shift works from reading the manual, but what you’re describing seems more advanced and there appears to be very little info in the manual about how shift+ and unshift work. I’ve tried programming a few attempts at interpreting what you’re suggesting, but none work, and I’m sure it’s because I’m not understanding what you’re suggesting. Hate to be more of a bother, but any chance you could set out the programming instructions in more detail so I can follow more easily?

I think the basic questions would be –

TUNER PRESET
(1) Do I put the CC command (to toggle the tuner on/off) to pos Shift? Or do I continue having it set to Pos 1 and Pos 2?
(2) What about the background color change commands (which currently change the color to yellow in Pos 1 and back to white (normal) in Pos 2?
(3) Then do I need a “Set Toggle → Shift” (or “Shift+”) command in the tuner preset?
(4) What do I need to do with unshift?

ALL OTHER PRESETS (which is only presets A-F)
(1) I think you’re saying I should create a “Set Toggle → Shift+” message for each of these presets and select the tuner preset box (which would be Preset V). Is that right?
(2) And then what is it I would need to do with “unshift” for these presets?
(3) Are there any other messages I would need to include in these (A-F) presets?
(4) Are any of these messages set to Pos Shift? Or are they all just set to Pos 1?

If it’s helpful, I’ve attached pics of how I have the tuner preset programmed now (prior to our discussion). Thanks again for your help!


I’ll be working on some presets tommorow. I’ll try to set up a bank for you that has the toggle stuff done. You’ll have to fill in the actual midi messages though. Do you need Preset A-F to have a toggle (on/off)?

Shift+ is like shift. The difference is that if a preset is in position shift+ engaging the preset will trigger all messages which have been programmed with ‘pos shift’ and in addition to that all messages that have been programmed with the position the preset has been in when it was shifted.

For example:
A preset is in pos2. A simple press would send a PC message.
The preset is then toggled to shift+.
The shift message would send a CC on press.
If you press the foot switch both the PC and CC message would be triggered.

Unshift reverts a preset back to normal without sending any messages programmed with ‘pos shift’

That would be amazing. Thanks! And yes, I have the tuner preset set to toggle off Presets A-F when the tuner gets turned on (because I turn off all the loops except for the tuner loop when I engage the tuner preset, which means I then need to re-turn on one of the other presets after tuning, to turn back on the loops I need to continue playing.

Actually much leaner version
Morningstar_MC6PRO_Bank_Backup_Tuner_20240125_142219.json (88.9 KB)

Ignore the CC#1-5, those are just test dummies :sweat_smile:

Thanks for this! It doesn’t quite seem to be working though. The tuner turns on and off, as normal, when just using Preset V. And if I turn the tuner on (with Preset V) and then press another preset, the tuner turns off. But the color doesn’t change (from yellow/red to white/black). It stays as yellow/red. That preset also doesn’t stay toggled on. When I press the preset again, then the color changes to white/black, but then the tuner turns back on (and the preset remains toggled off). If I press it a third time, it then toggles on, but the tuner stays on.

I posted a new version above did you test this?
Worked when i tested it.
Maybe something with the controller settings?

I’m only seeing one version, with some delete messages above it, so I think I never saw the old versions. So not sure where the discrepancy is, or how controller settings could come into play. But I’ll play around and see what I can figure out. Either way, appreciate your help!

There is an ‘engage preset’ message in preset A (msg 3) that contains an ‘engage preset’ command.
You’ll have to update the bank number. Most likely the culprit

The first thing I did was update the bank to “current bank,” which I think should have done the trick as far as that goes (I have the tuner preset added to every bank).

Do you have ‘Clear preset toggles’ active in your bank settings? Should be off.
I just checked again, everything works as I’d expect.

I thought that might be it! I did have that set for a while, but I stopped doing it that way a bit ago, so no, that is not active in my bank settings.

I’m curious what went wrong here. If you boot up the bank presets A-F should show A1,B1,C1 …
If you engage a preset for example a it should toggle from A1 to A2 and back again.
If you engage the tuner the first time all presets should show an S. A S, B S …
and the strip should channge to yellow.
Engaging any preset will change the color and set all presets to 1 except the preset you’ve engaged this should go to 2.
When does this stop working?

Confirmed

Confirmed

This is where it breaks down. When I engage the tuner preset, and then select, e.g., the A preset, the color changes to white, but the tuner functionality isn’t turned off on the LVX. The A preset changes to A2, but all the other presets remain as BS, CS, etc. If I press, e.g., the BS preset at that point, the color changes back to yellow and that preset changes to B2 (but the tuner remains on on the LVX). The only way to get the tuner to turn off is to press the tuner preset again.